‘One of the drawbacks of working in the traditional publishing world is that they’re very, very big on the idea that you need to go out and sell books. I’ve always thought of a book as something that should go out and sell the author, so the reason I write books is to get a message out there to connect with a lot of people. For me, it’s more important that the book is out there doing its job, as opposed to just simply trying to sell the book. The book, for us, fits within a broader context of a bigger business.’
For Daniel Priestley, author of bestsellers such as Key Person of Influence, The Entrepreneur Revolution and Oversubscribed, a book is the ultimate business development tool. It costs a fraction of a business development manager, it never gets tired or leaves to join the competition, and it never goes off sick or off-message. His own books sit at the heart of his businesses, and in this episode he reveals the strategies he’s used to integrate the two so successfully, and goes under the hood to share how he developed and wrote his new book, 24 Assets.
This is one to listen to again and again.
Key Person of Influence: http://www.keypersonofinfluence.com/
24 Assets: http://www.24assets.com/
Daniel on Twitter: https://twitter.com/DanielPriestley
The Extraordinary Business Book Club on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1447064765612358/
Alison on Twitter: https://twitter.com/bookstothesky
Alison Jones: Hello, and welcome to the Extraordinary Business Book Club. I’m absolutely thrilled to be here today with Daniel Priestley, who started out as an entrepreneur, aged 21, he’s one of those people who makes you wonder what you did with your life, quite frankly. By the age of 25, he’d built a multi-million dollar event marketing and management business, and he’s a cofounder of Dent, which runs accelerator programmes for small enterprises based on his Key Person of Influence model, which he’s going to talk about today.
One of the key parts of that programme is publishing a book. Daniel himself has written three international bestsellers and one just about to come out. The three that are published are Key Person of Influence, The Entrepreneur Revolution, and Oversubscribed, which is my personal favourite. I love Oversubscribed. He’s just published 24 Assets, the fourth one. So welcome to the club, Daniel. Good to have you here.
Daniel Priestley: Well, thank you very much. Especially with a name like the Extraordinary Business Book Club, how could I not be on … Can’t resist it.
Alison Jones: Good. I’m glad you like it. I’ve discovered it’s terribly long when you’re tweeting. That’s the only bad thing about it.
Daniel Priestley: The modern conundrum. How do you fit your business name into a tweet?
Alison Jones: Yeah, unless you make up something that has no meaning. Anyway, I like Extraordinary Business Book Club. It’s a bit of a mouthful, but I do like it. I’m glad it resonates with you. I have to say, you’re one of the people, which I was first planning the show and thinking about it, I thought, “I want to get Daniel Priestley,” because you’re doing what I talk about so much on this show, and what I talk about with my clients, which is showing how a book fits into a business, becomes the engine of a business. I think Key Person of Influence is such a great example of that. It’s the one I often use which I’m talking to people. It was a book. It became a programme. It’s practically a whole business now.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah.
Alison Jones: Did you plan it that way from the get-go?
Daniel Priestley: Yeah, a little bit actually. The programme launched in 2010, and the book came out late 2010, early 2011, I think. I actually wrote the book as part of the business materials, and as one of our marketing strategies. I always intended to give away lots of those books as a way of connecting with people, and telling our story, so to a little bit of a degree, yeah, actually it was planned. It was one of those things where we always said a book is a very powerful business tool.
Alison Jones: It’s interesting that you say that you almost designed it to give away, rather than to sell. I think that’s still something some people have a hard time getting their head around.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah, I have… two are published with traditional publishing, and two of them with a hybrid publisher. One of the drawbacks of working in the traditional publishing world is that they’re very, very big on the idea that you need to go out and sell books. I’ve always thought of a book as something that should go out and sell the author, so the reason I write books is to get a message out there to connect with a lot of people. For me, it’s more important that the book is out there doing its job, as opposed to just simply trying to sell the book. The book, for us, fits within a broader context of a bigger business.
Alison Jones: Yeah, and of course you just put your finger there on the whole problem with traditional publishers and business books is that actually there’s conflicting agendas, because the only revenue the publisher has is from the sale of the book, but the revenue that the author makes is massively bigger from the business than from the royalties.
Daniel Priestley: I know. I’ve said this to my publishers. I’ve said, “You know, you’re crazy not to actually take a stake in the actual author,” because you might sell … I mean, if you sell 10,000 books, there might be 10,000 pounds of royalty checks the flow around, but you might do an extra 500,000 pounds with the business.
Alison Jones: It’s a really interesting idea, isn’t it? It comes down to the attribution model, I suppose.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah.
Alison Jones: You know, how much of the growth of this business is down to the book?
Daniel Priestley: Well, in the music industry, they know this. You know, they don’t just sort of take a stake in the album. They actually take a stake in the artist. That includes tours and merchandise. They’ve really figured out the whole ecosystem in the music system, but the book industry, they haven’t figured this out yet.
Alison Jones: That’s so interesting. A lot of authors don’t tour well, to be fair. Most business book authors do, because they’re used to presenting.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah, absolutely. It’s really suitable for that sort of business or that nonfiction world – personal development, physical development, business development – all those kind of books, they suit that model really well.
Alison Jones: Well, we’re touching on it already, to be honest, but can you encapsulate for us – I know this is part of the KPI programme – why is publishing a book so important for a business these days?
Daniel Priestley: Well, there’s several reasons. Number one, in the process of writing a book, you’re mining deep for your ideas in your intellectual property, so even if you never even sold any books, or even if just never even published the book, it would still be a worthwhile activity, because in the process of writing, you get very clear on your case studies, your stories, your methodologies. Frameworks come out. All of that intellectual property comes out during the writing process. Writing is almost … It’s a process that allows you to reflect upon what you know, and formalise what you know into a document, and then that content becomes blogs, articles, workshop materials. It really ends up living across a number of different platforms, even brochure copy, I guess to an extent.
That copy gets used in a multitude of ways. When you do actually publish the book, a number of things happen. People see you as an authority in your space, so the word author and authority are actually closely linked, you know, because when you author something, you tend to be regarded as someone who cares enough about the topic to but writing a book about it, so it puts you in a different league. You get invited into media opportunities, so you often get invited to radio or television, because you’re the author of a particular book. You get invited onto people’s podcasts.
You also have another product to sell, which is if you want to sell the book, and you have a way of scaling relationships. I remember as someone starting out in business, that I would read business books, and I would really connect with the author. You know, I’d hear their stories, and I’d reread over certain pages and get the lessons. For me, as a reader, it was almost like having a conversation or having a mentoring session with someone when I was reading their book. I was always excited to then go on to meet the people who had written the book. To be on the other side of that, as an author, is really a wonderful thing, because you know, there are people, there are literally tens of thousands of people out there every feel that they have some sort of relationship with you, and they’re excited or interested to meet you, which is brilliant, as well.
Alison Jones: And that’s interesting, isn’t it, because I think you touch on something really important there, which is unique to the book, or certainly the print book, is that you’re reading a book, it feels like a one-on-one. It feels like a really intimate relationship, but as you say, it’s infinitely scalable.
Daniel Priestley: You know, I’ve had people tweet me and say, “I’m in the bath with Daniel Priestley. I’m on holiday with Daniel Priestley.” I mean, goodness, my life would be very, very interesting if I went everywhere my book had gone.
Alison Jones: There’s a novel in here somewhere, isn’t there?
Daniel Priestley: Yeah. Exactly. But the other way I look at it is in my business career, I’ve had development managers whose job is to get out there and talk to people, you know, open relationships and generate business, and all those sorts of things. Realistically, if a business development manager was incredibly driven, they could possibly be out there doing that job 1600 hours per year and a lot of that would be wasted time. As a business you’d spend something like £50,000 putting someone into that role. They may get the message right. They may need a training period. They may have sick days. They may become awesome and leave and go work somewhere else, but you’re going to spend £50,000 a year on a business development manager who’s pounding the streets opening relationships for you. I look at this idea of 1600 hours that they could spend, and I simply think, “Well, what if I just print 1600 books and send them out to all the same people at a fraction of the cost? and it actually kind of does the same job.
Alison Jones: Yeah. I can’t remember who said the quote, that wonderful quote that great content is the best salesperson in the world…
Daniel Priestley: It really is.
Alison Jones: Substitute book for that.
Daniel Priestley: It never has a sick day. It never gets the message wrong, and it never leaves. It never gets excited to go off. You know, your book’s not going to quit and go do something else.
Alison Jones: Yeah. Books, you can rely on them. I like that. Tell about the latest. Tell us about 24 Assets. How are you developing that idea? Where did that come from?
Daniel Priestley: Well, 24 Assets is a book about the exciting times that we live in, and how to make the most of those times. It focuses the reader onto 24 digital assets that help a business grow and scale. In the last 15 years, we’ve had young, wunderkinds from Silicon Valley inventing all of these platforms that have disrupted and transformed the business landscape. In the next 15 years, every business in the world has the opportunity to really make the most of those platforms, and really make the most of the exciting technology that’s available now.
I created a framework for doing that. It actually looks at what are the assets you’re going to upload into these? What’s the brand going to be? What’s the intellectual property? What’s the what we call produce assets or culture assets that you’re going to create? If you can create these digital assets in 24 different categories, you’ll end up with a very valuable and scalable business ecosystem. This is something that can help you to build a business that could be sold. It’s something that could help you to build a business that could scale internationally. It’s certainly something that would help you take your business into the more digital online realm. Yeah, and also, remove a lot of stress and have a lot of fun.
Alison Jones: I noticed that you said that one of the points about an asset is that it drives revenue, that you don’t get revenue without this underlying asset, which I thought was an interesting insight. I mean, which you say it, it seems obvious, but you know, I hadn’t thought of it in that way, and of course, a book is one of those, as well, isn’t it? Even thought it’s not necessarily…
Daniel Priestley: No, in the book, we call this intellectual property assets, and there’s a category there called Content, and absolutely, it’s one of the assets that does drive revenue. Intellectual property ends up being scaled across a number of the other assets, but yeah, a hundred percent. In the same way that if you want to have rental income, you first need to own houses, and if you want dividend checks, you need to own shares. If you want a more successful business, you need to develop the business’s assets.
Alison Jones: Did anything surprise you? I mean, I liked the way that you talked earlier about one of the reasons for writing is because it makes you think better. What did you discover as you wrote this book, and how did your own ideas crystallise and develop?
Daniel Priestley: Great question. It was a great opportunity for me to interview some interesting people who had built and sold very valuable companies, and actually, it was a great excuse to sort of sit down and have in depth conversations with them.
Alison Jones: That’s another great reason for writing a book is it gives you a reason to talk to people, really interesting people, doesn’t it?
Daniel Priestley: It sure does. I discovered a lot of things. I discovered that actually I’ve got a real passion for digital technology and for software and all those sorts of things, which is not my background, but it’s certainly something that I’ve … In the process of this, I actually developed software that goes along with the book, so people can log in and actually codify their assets as they currently are. I really clarified my thinking about the times we live in, and how they’re so disruptive.
I actually cover some topics at the end there about how Brexit, why Trump, you know, why these things are happening, and it’s not because of the main reasons that we’re given. It talks about we have, you know, the Millennials and the Baby Boomers. We have different agendas at the moment. We have globalisation and digital outsourcing where we’re outsourcing a lot of jobs to different countries around the world, and building global workforces, so I actually cover some of the other trends that are being driven by technology and demographics, as opposed to the kind of common answers of immigration and the kind of news headline-type answers that we get given around these things. For me, I really clarified my thinking around that. I also clarified my thinking around exactly how a business can have a purpose, and how it can actually create really tangible ways to live that purpose.
Alison Jones: Oh, I love that. Tell me a little bit more about that software, because I saw on the site that you’ve got a kind of diagnostic tool on there, haven’t you, that complements the book. But tell me how you build the touchpoints between the ideas in the book, which is the sort of the deep dive, the exploration, that close relationship with the reader, and then bringing them into your world, and being able to sell them goods and services on top of that?
Daniel Priestley: Well, the book invites the reader to take the online diagnostic, so that they have a clear starting point as to how they’re doing with their current assets. Halfway through the book, it actually says, “If you want to, now would be a good time to go onto 24Assets.com and fill in all the dots, and actually get a score on all your 24 assets.” Then the next phase of that software is actually going to allow people to create a profile where they can store their assets, actually create almost like a project management approach to improving their assets. Then in that, they’ll get given suggestions for books they could read, videos they could watch, supplies that they could use. All of that sort of stuff will be built into the portal.
Alison Jones: Which is very, very smart. Certainly that’s the starting point of the quiz, that the benchmarking idea. It’s almost irresistible, isn’t it? You know, how am I doing, and how do I compare?
Daniel Priestley: Yeah. I mean, the reason I think a lot of people are enjoying that is because in the world we live in right now, there is so much confusion and noise, there’s so many people saying, “Oh, you need to have this lead funnel things, and you need to be doing Instagram, and you need to use Facebook ads, and you need to have a team that uses Dropbox and Slack.” There’s kind of like all these things that you need to do, and very quickly, it turns into this kind of unholy to-do list of stuff, and it just feels so overwhelming.
What we’ve tried to achieve through 24 Assets is just a really simple way of looking at your business, and all the complexity basically comes back to 24 things. Pretty much every tool that’s out there is designed to impact one of those 24 areas. Essentially, if you score yourself as to what’s red, what’s yellow, what’s green, you know, then you can actually evaluate, “Do I need to make something that’s already working work better, or should I make this thing that’s bottle-necking … You know, should I improve one of the reds into a yellow into a green, or should I just make the greens super green. Most people realise that they’ve spent a lot of time on the same stuff, and actually there’s a few other areas that they may want to explore.
Alison Jones: I like the idea of ‘super green’.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah, well I can relate to that, because like for me is to create content, to write, and sort of after three or four best-selling books, you should say, “Actually, Dan, you’ve got the best-selling books. You need to work on your data project …
Alison Jones: Ah.
Daniel Priestley: … or you need to work on … You know, it will stem into more diverse topics.
Alison Jones: Or you go super green on the books.
Daniel Priestley: I’ll go super green on the books. Why not?
Alison Jones: I think there’s something really powerful about the number, as well, because as you say, we are all kind of drowning in a sea of stuff and overwhelm. Just 24 things, huh? Well, it’s a lot, but it’s manageable.
Daniel Priestley: It is, yeah.
Alison Jones: And that’s powerful, isn’t it?
Daniel Priestley: And 24 will cause overwhelm unless you’ve got a way of organising that.
Alison Jones: Right.
Daniel Priestley: The human brain can manage about three to seven projects at any given time, and when your little brain, or when my little brain hits seven things, eight things, nine things, I go into a little bit of stress and overwhelm. But 24 Assets makes 24 things into just one thing, so it kind of reduces the overwhelm, reduces the complexity.
Alison Jones: So one thing at a time, certainly.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah.
Alison Jones: Love it. And when you write, when you actually sit down, how does Daniel Priestley actually do the physical act of writing? What works for you?
Daniel Priestley: There’s a few things that work for me. My first three books I wrote just in normal Word or Pages, but actually 24 Assets I wrote using a piece of software called Scrivener.
Alison Jones: Ha, ha. We love Scrivener.
Daniel Priestley: I know. I mean, where has it been all of my life? I’m not a big fan of tools and like getting hung up on tools, and getting like … Because I’ve always said, “Look, the tools don’t write the book for you. Plenty of the world’s best authors have written books on type-writers or pad and pencil and paper, so I think there’s something great about just, you know, not relying upon too many tools. But this particular tool is actually really good for organising your thinking, so I like Scrivener.
The other thing I like to do is from the outset of writing a book, I like to create a playlist of just maybe 15 different songs, mostly instrumental, no words. What I’ll do is I’ll create a Spotify playlist, and I’ll put my headphones on, and I’ll listen to that playlist on repeat while I’m writing. It serves two purposes. Number one, it blocks out the outside world, and it’s very familiar music, so it’s just there in the background thumping away.
The other thing it does is it allows me to get back into the book a lot faster. So, if I’ve only got an hour to write, what I’ve found is when I didn’t have a playlist, it would take me a good 15, 20 minutes just to read back over what I was writing before, and to find my place as to what I’m trying to say, and kind of get my head back in the zone. Whereas, when I had a playlist that was very distinctive for that book, it would actually kind of trigger being in the zone, being in the mode a lot faster, and I’m able to just get back into the book a lot faster, so it might take 10 minutes rather than 20 minutes to just get into the writing zone.
Alison Jones: That’s fascinating, and very interesting as well, because I was talking to Caroline Webb recently who wrote How To Have a Good Day, who did exactly the same. She was going into the neurology behind that, you know the way that the associations that music creates are so powerful.
Daniel Priestley: There we go. Well, I’m glad a few people have discovered this. It’s really a great hack for me.
Alison Jones: It’s a great hack.
Daniel Priestley: The other one’s a black coffee. I love a good black coffee before I arrive. It kind of jump starts the brain.
Alison Jones: That’s classic writer’s stuff, isn’t it?
Daniel Priestley: Yeah.
Alison Jones: It’s probably not infinitely scalable, though, unlike the playlist. Give us a sample of what’s on your playlist.
Daniel Priestley: Mostly trance music; Above and Beyond is kind of a UK … I think they’re a UK band. But, I just kind of … melodic trance type music.
Alison Jones: Well, this seems to be pop … This is a theme, and it’s so not me, so I might have to experiment here, but Caroline said she started off with Haydn string quartets. Then she got bored of that, and she went straight to deep house, which apparently is actually very similar.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah. Deep house and trance and that sort of stuff, I found, it’s just that kind of thump in the background. You know, nothing hard house, nothing over the top, but just kind of like it’s just provides this kind of da dum, da dum, da dum, da dum, da dum in the background. It’s almost like a metronome or something. You know, it’s giving you a heartbeat to write to.
Alison Jones: Oh, that’s a nice phrase. I like that.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah.
Alison Jones: Brilliant. Nothing with words, though, because obviously the cognitive processing that you have to do when words are playing is going to distract you from writing.
Daniel Priestley: Exactly. I mean there’s a couple of songs that might have had some words in there, but mostly it’s just instrumental.
Alison Jones: Brilliant. That’s so interesting.
Daniel Priestley: Instrumental trance.
Alison Jones: Fantastic. So, instrumental trance, that’s one top tip. But, if I asked you – there’s going to be people listening to this for whom you are a real model in that they might be ploughing through their first business book – what’s the top tip that you would give them to help them break through the blocks, and just make this really work?
Daniel Priestley: You mean for actually finding content?
Alison Jones: Well, for making the book work. I know a lot of people, they know the subject, but translating that into a book is a big ask.
Daniel Priestley: All right. Yeah. I work on a couple of ideas, which is number one, I’m trying to sell you on an idea. Every book that I write, I don’t tiptoe around the fact that I’m trying to sell you on a new way of doing things. I want you to take actions that you wouldn’t have taken, had you not read the book. You know, I think some people kind of get a little bit academic, or a little bit … They don’t want to push the reader, or they don’t want the reader to … don’t make any rash decisions. Let me just share with you some knowledge and some stories, and hopefully you enjoy that.
Alison Jones: So British, isn’t it?
Daniel Priestley: Yeah. It’s a little bit British. I’m kind of the other way. I’m saying: Okay. If I’m going to write a book, I’m going to try and make an argument, make a case, and actually I want to try and challenge you and push you to do something you never would have done had you not read the book. So, I start from that premise. Then I try and pull all the stops out, and actually go for that. In Oversubscribed, I really want the reader to run campaigns and promotions, and I want them to actually-
Alison Jones: So practical.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah. I want them to schedule events. I want them to schedule new marketing campaigns, and I want them to completely do that at a level that they never would have done, had they not read the book. All the way through, I’m pushing the reader to try and … I want you to go out and run these campaigns. That’s what I want you to do. In Key Person Of Influence, I want you to position yourself as a key person of influence in your industry. Stop playing small. Stop playing as a worker bee. Stop hiding out behind a brand, and go build a personal brand.
Alison Jones: So, be less British, be more Aussie, maybe.
Daniel Priestley: Yeah. Work out in advance what are you trying to sell the reader? What are you actually trying to sell them as far as a new action? What are you trying to … Yeah, what are you challenging people to go do? What action do you want? I like to imagine people slam the book shut, and then they go off and do something. It’s like: What do I want them to go and do? It’s like that’s how I approach things.
Then I break it into three parts. Part one is to interrupt their current thinking. So, I challenge people on their current thinking. There are chapters like: The World Has Changed, and So Must You; and The Singer Versus The Microphone Paradox, and really trying to challenge the status quo, challenge the way people might already be thinking.
In 24 Assets, I talk about how passive income’s going to send you broke, and I’m challenging that current world view, and I’m challenging the idea that profit and loss is a good thing. I say, “I want you to stop thinking about P&L, and start thinking about your balance sheet.” I try and transform that different type of thinking.
Then the middle section is always a methodology. Now I’ve interrupted your current way of thinking, here’s a methodology, a new way of seeing the world. Then part three of my books is all about how do you implement? How do you actually put this in place? What are some of the things you’re going to have to do if you put this … Now that you’re thinking your way around this new way of thinking, how do you go about living your life and taking actions based on these new principles?
Alison Jones: I love that, so you’ve got a three-part ‘provoke, posit and plan’ structure.
Daniel Priestley: There we go, yeah. There. Oh, I like it. It’s all … You’ve even turned it into a method. I like it.
Alison Jones: Boom. Yeah, no it’s really interesting, just to see that, because I think that narrative shape, you know, the big overall macro structure of the book, if you like, is what a lot of authors do struggle with. So, I think that that’s a really helpful model. So, thank you. Really, really good. Now, I always ask my guests to recommend another guest for the show. This is how you came here, because Lucy McCarraher recommended you, of course. Who do you think would be a great guest for this show? Someone with something interesting to say about the business of business books, and the writing, and the publishing of them?
Daniel Priestley: Well, someone who has written a really interesting book is Martin Norbury. He was the CEO of a publicly-listed company. He had 600 employees that reported to him, and he had 150 million revenue. They were doing these big acquisitions and all that sort of stuff. Then, through a personal tragedy in his family, he decided to leave that world and take some time off. Then he started he was going to start more of a lifestyle business, and created a business with one rule, which was I don’t work Fridays. So, he would only ever work four days a week, but he wanted to actually maintain a really big lifestyle and be successful, and all of that.
Two things that Martin does is that he brings big business thinking into the world of small business. So, he brings kind of CEO publicly-listed company thinking to the world of small business. Also, he brings the idea of actually you can have a high degree of performance and still do four days a week.
His book is called I Don’t Work Fridays, and yeah, it’s … I wrote the foreword for it. Martin’s an interesting character.
Alison Jones: That sounds fascinating. We’ll look forward to getting Martin on. I shall tell him that you recommended him. I’m sure that’ll be a magic way in. Thank you for that. Now, if you ever want to find out more about you, more about 24 Assets, or any of the other books that we’ve talked about today, where should they go?
Daniel Priestley: Couple of places: KeyPersonofInfluence.com is a good place to start for a lot of content and blogs and articles. The 24Assets.com is where you can go and take that test, and actually score yourself on the 24 assets. For anyone who’s interested in writing books, taking the Key Person Of Influence scorecard is also a good one, because it kind of tells you how you score as a key person of influence. That’s on KeyPersonofInfluence.com. People can follow me on Twitter. If you Google Daniel Priestley, you’ll find me on Instagram, you’ll find me on Twitter and all those kind of places. Yeah, and Facebook and LinkedIn, of course.
Alison Jones: It gets to be quite a long list, doesn’t it? You can find me on pretty much every social media platform.
Daniel Priestley: You can just find me everywhere, and hang out and stalk. You can go and sit by my front door and wait for me to come home, and sign autographs as I come to and from, go about my day. All of those things. Yeah. Anything at all.
Alison Jones: Do you have a social media platform you hang out on most, or are you always on Twitter? Or, do you save your best conversations for LinkedIn? How does it work?
Daniel Priestley: I tend to have a bigger conversation on Facebook. I put a lot of stuff on Facebook. I’ve maxed out my friend requests, but I think about five or six thousand people follow along, so there’s a lot of engagement just on Facebook. I love Twitter, because it connects me with people all over the world, in a really nice, fast way. And, more of more I’ve been getting into Instagram.
I don’t tend to spend a lot of time on LinkedIn, and I don’t tend to spend a lot of time on the Google one, whatever that one is.
Alison Jones: Yeah, remember that?
Daniel Priestley: Yeah. Post videos on YouTube and all that sort of stuff, but yeah, I find that Twitter, Instagram and Facebook are where the most of the conversations happen.
Alison Jones: Fantastic. Instagram is still a bit of a mystery to me. I don’t really get it. My daughter keeps banging on about it, but I’ll get there in the end.
Daniel Priestley: Basically, you just kind of try and take photos that make you look cool.
Alison Jones: That’s where I’m going wrong.
Daniel Priestley: That’s basically it. As you board the plane, you want to quickly sit down in first class, take a photo of yourself there, and then go move back to economy and post it on Instagram.
Alison Jones: Do you know that might just be the most valuable tip we’ve ever had on the Extraordinary Business Book Club. Thank you for that great way to end. Thank you so much. Literally could have talked to you all day. Thank you so much for your time, Daniel.
Daniel Priestley: My pleasure. Thanks for having me.