Episode 76 – Think #Digital First with Warren Knight

Warren KnightWarren Knight isn’t your traditional entrepreneur (whatever that is). He began as a hip hop dancer, and quite simply saw the opportunities that presented themselves at each step and grabbed them with both hands. Today he helps companies around the world transform themselves into digital organisations. His book Think #Digital First came out of those conversations. First published in 2015, it’s now in its second edition, but what’s even more interesting to EBBC listeners is the way that Warren has created ‘micro-niche’ editions to serve specific market sectors.

This is a great example here of creating a book that’s completely tuned to its readers’ needs:

‘I wanted to tell my story… all of these stories of closing doors, turning over 30 million dollars. All of those stories that I needed to put down in a book, but it needed to have a purpose and a goal… I was doing a lot of coaching, working with businesses. And the thing that they kept saying was, “Oh, Warren, I know I really need to be thinking digital first with what I’m doing, with my business. I have a great offline business but how can I take it online?” So their thinking needs to shift. “We’ve got a good business and we know what we do well, but my thinking needs to be about what we can do from an online perspective.” And I came out of having a meeting and I went, “That’s it.” I’d written it down three times in three different meetings. I went, “That’s the title of the book…. I now know what my purpose is, I know where it needs to start. And now I know where it needs to finish.”‘



LINKS:

Warren’s site: http://warren-knight.com/

Warren on Twitter: https://twitter.com/WarrenKnight

Think #Digital First: http://www.thinkdigitalfirst.com/

The Extraordinary Business Book Club on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/groups/1447064765612358/

The 10-day Business Book Proposal Challenge (starts 18 September): https://alisonjones.leadpages.co/proposal-challenge/

Alison Jones:                        Hello and welcome to The Extraordinary Business Book Club, and I’m very, very happy to be here today with Warren Knight who is a speaker, a trainer, an author and a digital entrepreneur who helps companies grow through digital transformation. And his book, Think #Digital First, is now in its second edition. Welcome to the club, Warren.

Warren Knight:                   Thank you very much, Alison. It’s lovely to be here with you. Thank you for inviting me.

Alison Jones:                        You’re very welcome. It’s great to have you, and one of the first questions I’m dying to ask you, I want to find out a little bit more about your background, which is so interesting. And it all started with hiphop dancing?

Warren Knight:                   It did, it did. It’s quite funny, actually. When I … It’s only a case of when you look back, when you realise when you were younger some of the things that you did. And when I was, what, I think 19. I think 19, 20, when I actually started to get paid for dancing. And it didn’t feel like a job and I didn’t feel like a professional speaker, I never really classed myself as a professional speaker until the day where I met somebody at an event and they were like, “Would you like to come and dance on TV?” And I was like, “Yeah, I’d be great to do that,” and they go, “Well, we’re gonna pay you to do that.” I’d be like, “Really? Pay me? As well?”

Alison Jones:                        “I thought I had to pay you.”

Warren Knight:                   Yeah, “You mean I get on TV and you pay me to do that? Gosh. Now I really am a professional speaker. A professional hiphop dancer.” So, yeah, it was fantastic. I got to travel around the UK, I did stuff with The Prodigy and Shades of Rhythm. I worked a lot with … In those days you had the illegal raves that were going on, so we’re talking about ’88, ’89, ’90. And I used to spend a lot of my time at those events, again just getting paid to dance and being on stage in front of 10,000 people. It was amazing.

Alison Jones:                        And I love that little Freudian slip about professional dancer, professional speaker. Obviously the two are very closely linked, in your mind.

Warren Knight:                   Of course they are, because it’s quite … One of my little tricks, if you like, when I’m on stage, is I get the MC, the CEO, whoever it might be that’s running the event, and I get them to come on stage and I show them how to moonwalk in front of everybody on the stage. So we moonwalk across the stage together. And depending on how flexible they’re being around what they’re doing at the moment, we might do a bit of popping and locking and a bit of a wave going on. But the moonwalk definitely gets the crowd moving, shall we say.

Alison Jones:                        I can imagine that there are CEOs who are up for that and CEOs who are so far out of their comfort zone they can’t even see it anymore…

Warren Knight:                   Yeah, it’s really fun, actually. One guy, he must have been, I’m not joking, he must … I was over in Prague and he was about 6’5″. And he was massive, and he was well built as well. And I got him up on the stage and at the end, when I’d finished speaking, he said, “I’ve never come across anybody that’s made me look small on stage.” I was like, “Hmm, okay, I’ll take that as a compliment, but- ”

Alison Jones:                        Yeah, that could have meant a number of things, couldn’t it?

Warren Knight:                   It could have done, it could have done. So, yeah.

Alison Jones:                        But how did you get from hiphop to here?

Warren Knight:                   So from hiphop dancing I then started to run my own clubs, so I was running drum and bass clubs in London. And that was round about … so I was about 21, 22. Then I went for a loan, well, grant actually, from the Prince’s Youth Business Trust, which I got a grant for 5,000 pounds to start my own clothing company, because when I was running my clubs I used to have my security wearing the brand T-shirts and the brand jacket. And I got other clubs that were on at that time asking me, “Where did you get those from?” And I went, “I could do them for you.”

And then one thing led to another and the next thing I know, I’m working with Ministry of Sounds and they said, “Okay, we’ve got these jackets and T-shirts now, Warren, but the only clients that we’ve got are at the club.” I said, “Well, I travel up and down the country doing the dancing and running clubs and that, why don’t I actually come and distribute your merchandise for you?” And so then I went to the Prince’s Youth Business Trust, got the grant and I became a clothing distribution company pretty much overnight, once I’d got the grant from Prince’s Youth Business Trust.

And then I started my own clothing range. So I designed a streetwear clothing range and I had the UK’s number one skateboarder, who I was sponsoring at that time, and so that just kept the clothing, the music, because it was all music-orientating, clothing orientated. Just sort of moving. But by the time I got to the age of 27 I’d built a really nice business, and I had employees, but I burnt myself out. I’d literally forgotten about me, and I was so focused on the business that I just literally woke up one day and I went, “I can’t do this anymore.” And I went to the office, and I closed the doors for the very last time, and just went home.

And I went through a bit of a depression, I couldn’t really get up in the mornings, it was really hard for me and hard for my partner who I was with at that time. And then she just came home one day and went, “I never know what sort of mood you’re gonna be in.” And I went, “God, what, that really isn’t me at all.” So I picked up the newspaper, thought what sort of sales job could I go for? And I got this commission only job, walked into a company and he just said to me, “Do you wanna go for lunch?” And I was like, “Okay.” And I was selling what I was selling at that time, and I didn’t realise at that time but he was actually grilling me for a job within his company. When I told him about what I did in the past, and where I’d got to, he was like, “I’d love you to come and work with me, Warren.”

And then I worked with that company that happened to have a factory over in China selling products all around the world. I worked with that business and in the space of three years it went from 5 million dollars to 30 millions dollars turnover. And we had a global Disney licence around what was going on. So that was really, really exciting. I am going to get to the point in a minute. And then I went through a bit of a life shift and got involved in a campaign with a family member and decided to step out of the corporate world of working with Disney, and New Look, and Aldi, and Asda and Marks and Spencer’s, and during this campaign we worked with a lot of influencers, and those influencers were footballers. And one footballer happened to mention our campaign on his Facebook page back in 2007 and it crashed our website. The amount of traffic that we had going over to our website because of one post by an influencer inside of a social network crashed our website.

Alison Jones:                        And you thought, “Oh, that’s interesting.”

Warren Knight:                   Exactly, yeah. So our journey had finished at the end of eight months and I hadn’t been working during that time at all. I then realised that, actually, the world of social media is going to be massive for businesses. So I went back to Disney and I went, “Disney, do you want to talk about this thing called social media, and have an online store and all these amazing things that are going on?” They went, “No, why would we want that, Warren?” And then so I wished I kept knocking on the door, to be honest. But, so then I decided to go back to all of the places where I used to present my products, and that was all trade shows. So I went back to trade show organiser and I went, “Um, you know this social media thing that people are talking about?” They went, “Yeah.” I said, “I’d love to come and do a presentation at one of your events. I used to book your stand,” they go, “Yeah, we know who you are, Warren. Yeah, come, why not? We’ve got a slot. Come and talk about social media.” And that’s how it all started.

Alison Jones:                        I love that. What I love about this is it shows you that entrepreneurship is a state of mind rather than any kind of technical expertise, isn’t it? Because the whole way through you just see the next opportunity and go for it. And I love the chutzpah as well, the fact that you know you might never have done social media stuff before, particularly. That’s no barrier! You know you can do it. It’s just such a great mindset reminder, isn’t it?

Warren Knight:                   Yeah, it is. I mean, to be fair, I had spent a whole year, I went over to America, I got to learn from internet marketeers, I got some great knowledge from guys coming from America over here, went on three day courses. I spent a lot of money on myself to understand what was going on, and I knew that space to a degree, as much as you can in 12 months. But I certainly knew a lot more than the majority of all of the businesses that were at that event. And so-

Alison Jones:                        Certainly at Disney at that time, yeah.

Warren Knight:                   Exactly, exactly. So-

Alison Jones:                        But you take my point, it’s absolutely … ‘I can see this is going to be the thing and I’m just going to go for it,’ it’s fantastic. So tell us a little bit about the book. Tell us about Think #Digital First. How did that come about?

Warren Knight:                   It came about … I’d always wanted to write my story, and I’m very transparent around who I am and what it is that I do, and I believe … I’ve spent quite a long time trying to get myself into this place of having a lifestyle. Not a work-life balance. I’m off to Lebanon at the weekend and I’m taking my wife and my daughter with me. And a part of that is, if you want me, we come as a package. And that’s my lifestyle.

Alison Jones:                        I saw your daughter just before we started speaking, she’s very sweet, isn’t she?

Warren Knight:                   She’s amazing.

Alison Jones:                        She is.

Warren Knight:                   Isn’t she?

Alison Jones:                        She made me broody again and I tell you, there’s not that much that makes me do that. She really is lovely.

Warren Knight:                   It’s really funny you should say that because the midwife that helped us when we had our natural birth, she kept coming in and bringing people in, going, “I’m really not broody at all, but she is making me broody.” But no, she’s amazing. Six months and she certainly knows how to wrap her dad round her finger already.

Alison Jones:                        Yeah, it’s only going to get worse, I can tell you that now.

Warren Knight:                   It is.

Alison Jones:                        Anyway. Back to the book

Warren Knight:                   Anyway. Back to the book. So the idea of it was I wanted to tell my story, but tell my story from an offline to an online experience, so everything that I’ve gone through in the last 25 years in business, all of my wins, fails, I built a technology company, million pounds, less than two years, had to close that down, didn’t get my million pound investment for my second round. You know, all of these stories of closing doors, turning over 30 million dollars. All of those stories that I needed to put down in a book, but it needed to have a purpose and a goal.

And I kept having … I was doing a lot of coaching, working with businesses. And the thing that they kept saying was, “Oh, Warren, I know I really need to be thinking digital first with what I’m doing, with my business. I have a great offline business but how can I take it online?” So their thinking needs to shift. We’ve got a good business and we know what we do well, but my thinking needs to be about what we can do from an online perspective. And I came out of having a meeting and I went, “That’s it.” I’d written it down three times in three different meetings. I went, “That’s the title of the book.”

Alison Jones:                        Yeah, that’s my title right there.

Warren Knight:                   Yeah. I now know what my purpose is, I know where it needs to start. And now I know where it needs to finish. And-

Alison Jones:                        And I think that’s a really great tip for authors, isn’t it? If you can tap in, tune in to what people are saying, when you get that repeated, you know you’re really onto a goldmine if you can address that.

Warren Knight:                   Hundred per cent. This is all about giving something to your audience that they have a need of, and I think a lot of people miss that when they’re writing their books because they write for themselves and not for the reader.

Alison Jones:                        Yeah. Interesting. And it’s partly workbook as well as just your expertise, isn’t it? Tell us how you put it together.

Warren Knight:                   The first book was very much story-driven, so telling stories about strategies, and goals and information around the different tools that you can use to achieve these different goals. And whilst getting, and I was very fortunate enough to rewrite the book in 11 different industries, and I’ve sold thousands of copies of the book, which is just amazing for me. But the feedback just kept coming back, I’d get pictures of people on the beach, “I need some space to write notes. I hear what you’re saying, Warren, but I don’t know how it applies to me.”

So I thought to myself, we’re three years down the line now since I first started writing the book. So much has changed, especially around Facebook and Instagram, and digital marketing around paid advertising and how people are using email marketing from an automation and artificial intelligence. All of these things have evolved, really over the last three years, into the mainstream. And so I thought, this is a really good time to listen to what the audience have already told me about the book and rewrite it in a way that allows people to take action whilst they’re reading the book inside of the book. So if you’re thinking about, what are the things that are most important to you to help you grow your business, this is what I think. What do you think?

Or inside of the book I’ve got a brand style guide, so if you’re not quite sure about the reasons why I chose the colours for my brand, these are the reasons. This is what I did. The branding actually comes from my history, which is a band called Run-DMC. And if you go back and have a look at the Run-DMC branding, I took that, I brought it into a new style, I gave it a flat font, flat design. Gave it flat colours and put it under my own branding. So when you look at the two of them together you go, “God, yeah, you’re right. They really are similar.” But it’s part of who I was, so I brought my branding into that story. So I tell that story, give my brand style guide, and then I go, “Now you go and decide what you want for your branding.”

Alison Jones:                        That’s very cool. And do you find people are actually willing to write in the book, because I always find that people don’t like to write in a traditional book, so having the workbook that you can download as a PDF A4 thing, great, we’ll scribble all over that. But in the book itself? Are people really happy to scribble in there?

Warren Knight:                   I do have the downloads as well, so you can go on the website and download every single workbook inside of the book. But I wanted to just listen to my audience, to be honest, and whether it’s about putting a sticky on there and going back to it later. Not only if they don’t want to have it in the book, but like you say, I wanted to have it. And under each of the workbooks styles is, “Go here to go and grab your download,” and then they download it in a workbook style based on the page that they’re in at the moment.

Alison Jones:                        Yeah, and of course that brings people from the offline world of the book to the online world where they’re seeing your site and engaging with you, aren’t they? So that’s fantastic.

Warren Knight:                   Yeah. It’s, for me, because it’s a business book, it’s what I class as a lead magnet. So somebody’s coming in and they’re interested in finding out more about how it can help them in their business at that price point of buying a book, and if they see it, the interest in wanting to download the workbook, then they come into an automated series of emails that keeps adding value to them, but also helping them to understand, well, there’s more that you can do and more that you can learn, and here’s how I can help you.

Alison Jones:                        Yes. And, I suppose, obviously the trigger there is from buying the book you’ve got to get into that email nurture sequence. And is the download of the resources, the way that they do that, they get onto your list? Or do you invite them to do that in the book?

Warren Knight:                   I invite them to do that in the book.

Alison Jones:                        Yes. And then you’ve got that nurture sequence and upsell for other stuff. Beautiful.

Warren Knight:                   Exactly.

Alison Jones:                        Yeah. I love that. That’s the curve, isn’t it? Nicholas Lovell talks about the curve. Gorgeous. How did you go about publishing the book, first time and second time?

Warren Knight:                   I spent a lot of time doing research. I went to lots of different events that people recommended and spoke to various different people. And I knew within my business model that I like to micro-niche. As I mentioned, I’ve rewritten the book in 11 different industries. So whether it-

Alison Jones:                        Yes, I want to come onto that, actually. Hold that thought.

Warren Knight:                   No problem. So because of doing that, after speaking with people, when you go to a publisher you have to buy your book back at an inflated price that obviously covers costs. And I didn’t want to have to do that because I wanted to add as much value to the micro niching as possible, and the organisations that I was working with. So I decided to go down the route of partnership publishing. And what that ultimately meant for me was I was in control of the look and the feel of the book, because I was very, shall we say, what’s the way to put … stubborn. And I didn’t want to be told what I should or shouldn’t do because I knew my audience.

So I decided to go down the publishing route, because – partnership publishing – because I was 100% in control of how I needed the book to look and to feel, but the publishing company gave me their resources to be able to help get it edited and to get it put in design. I already had designers to do the branding of the book, and all of my calls to action and all the call outs, and now the workbooks inside of this new book. So I needed a team to come together to help me deliver my vision.

But I also wanted, I didn’t want to have to go to knock on Amazon’s door and to go and get it into Gardners and to go and try and get it into different high street stores. I didn’t have the time to do that because I knew that, for me, my high level goal was about micro niching and giving the value to those small communities. And I knew, from a value perspective and from a revenue perspective, that, for me, was my high level goal with this book. And that’s why I went with partnership publishing.

Alison Jones:                        I think that’s such a great articulation of it. People talk about control and so on, but that’s a really good way of putting it: that you know where your skills are, you know exactly what you want to do with it, so you simply pay for the resource that you need to do that stuff that you know you can’t do. And partnership publishing’s great for that because it’s so much more flexible than a traditional publishing deal…

Warren Knight:                   It is, it is 100%. And so … Yeah, go on.

Alison Jones:                        … and it allows the book to work as a tool for your business primarily, rather than primarily being used as a tool to generate revenue for the publisher …

Warren Knight:                   Exactly.

Alison Jones:                        Which is the other way to …

Warren Knight:                   And that’s exactly what it is, and I wanted to take control of that because I knew what my business model needed to be for this to be a success rather than a publisher going, “Oh yeah, that’s really good, we’ll get that into WHSmith’s in all of the airports and everything.” Yes, lovely, fantastic, warm, fuzzy feeling. But actually, where’s the real value to me and my business?

Alison Jones:                        Yes, absolutely. And let’s go back to that point about that micro niching. So when you say that you did the book for 11 different industries, just tell us what that involved. How you did it.

Warren Knight:                   So because I have a good team around me, I was able to go to an industry and my very first … It was very really funny, actually. I sold the concept into a micro-niche audience before I’d even finished the book. And that’s how I knew that it was going to work.

Alison Jones:                        That’s the best way, isn’t it? When people are prepared to actually put their hand in their pocket and pay, you know you’ve got a proposition that’s going to work.

Warren Knight:                   Exactly. I literally just turned up with a printout of, this is going to be the book cover and these are the chapters inside of the book, and we’re going to, instead of saying entrepreneur, we’re going to say a jewellery business. And they went, “Oh, God, that’s amazing. We love that, Warren. No problem at all, we’ll get you speaking, we’ll do this, we’ll do that, we’ll take the books,” and so I knew, before I’d even started, that there was a potential opportunity for me there.

So my very first one was in the jewellery industry. I then went into the giftware industry, went into the beauty industry, went into the fitness industry, went into the hearing aid industry. Really, really seeing those, some of it was very, very micro-niche around what was going on, and again, it was great because it was all about being personal and personalization. And relevance to that audience. And that’s why I wanted to do that, for it not to be generic but very, very specific to them.

Alison Jones:                        And that’s fantastic, because of course print-on-demand technology, the new way that you can have of just printing something, and printing a really small quantity of something and changing it for a particular audience: it would have been prohibitively expensive to do this 20 years ago but now it’s actually really straightforward.

Warren Knight:                   I can get 50 or 100 books and get them delivered within two weeks.

Alison Jones:                        Yes. Amazing.

Warren Knight:                   So you obviously pay a bit of a premium for that, but the premium comes with the micro niching, so it works hand in hand.

Alison Jones:                        And of course you’re not relying on the revenue from the books, you’re relying on the revenue from the business. You’re doing it as a business opportunity, a lead magnet, and that’s where you’re going to get the return on investment, isn’t it?

Warren Knight:                   Exactly.

Alison Jones:                        Fantastic. So what impact has it had on you personally, do you think? Becoming an author, writing this book, and having it front and centre in your own personal brand?

Warren Knight:                   It’s done what I think going to a publisher would have done for me. So, in other words, I’ve been able to achieve, I’ve had my cake and eaten it, if you like. Because I’ve been able to micro-niche and get great revenue from the sales of the book, and I’ve also been seen as a published author, so I now get booked to speak in countries all over the world. I was in Prague and Israel last month, I’ve off to Lebanon in a week’s time.

So all of these countries and these niche areas are seeing me as an expert and asking me to come over there and bring copies of my book that we can use to give to the audience. So I’ve got books flying over to Lebanon as we speak at the moment, so when I arrive the book are there for the audience, and that enables me to do increase my worth at those events, and be booked as an expert and a professional speaker not only in the UK but other countries around the world.

Alison Jones:                        Yeah. And it’s classic, isn’t it? Suddenly you’ve got the book, you’ve got the speaking engagements. The two just work together beautifully. You sell the book at the talks and you get the talks because of the book, and … It’s a beautiful thing.

Warren Knight:                   It is, but I will say that I have invested quite heavily in myself, with my team, with being a better speaker and a professional speaker. I spent a lot of time being a public speaker and then perfecting the way that I communicate on stage, bringing my personality on stage but also getting that message across that connects with a very large percentage of the people in that room. So I have invested in myself quite heavily to achieve that outcome. It hasn’t come by luck. It’s hard work.

Alison Jones:                        What do you think the most valuable investment that you made in yourself to enable the lifestyle that you have now has been?

Warren Knight:                   When I came out of the campaign that I was running round about 2007, 2008, I was a little bit lost in regards to the direction that I wanted to go in. I didn’t want to work out of China anymore. I didn’t want to work with corporate companies. And I found myself a coach. And I worked with somebody for a very large sum of money over a three month period of time, who changed the way that I look at life. And he focused on my emotional aspects, and then helped me understand those emotional aspects and how to be who I am, and apply that into the business world.

And one of his key phrases for me that I’m forever repeating to myself, “The secret of living is giving.” And so, for me, I knew that was when I needed to give everything about, that I know, and put inside of a book, I just, at that time I didn’t quite have that purpose, that goal, to facilitate that outcome. And so, for me, in this day and age, the time that I spent with that guy, and he will stay nameless because that’s what he wants to be. He’s very much an under the radar entrepreneur. And he made me cry, he made me laugh. He made me open my eyes. He gave so much to me as a person. That one person, for me, then enabled me to have the stepping stones that I needed to know where I needed to push and where I needed to pull.

Alison Jones:                        Wow. That’s a really powerful … So it was very much the inner work that was the platform that enabled you then to go and do all of the technical stuff, the speaking, the writing and the lead magnet, the nurture sequence, all that stuff actually wouldn’t mean anything without that inner shift, would it?

Warren Knight:                   Yep. 100%, one of my first sentences on my very first page of my book is – let me just grab it here – is “This book is not for you if you pick things up and never finish them. If you skim read books and skip chapters midway through because you think you know what the first chapter is going to tell you.” You know, so…

Alison Jones:                        It’s about the deep work.

Warren Knight:                   It is about the deep work.

Alison Jones:                        Oh, wow.

Warren Knight:                   Chapter one’s all about you, the person you, sort you out and then everything will start falling into place.

Alison Jones:                        Brilliant. Thank you. Now, I always ask people to give their best tip for a first time author, so if somebody’s listening to this and going, “Oh, well it’s all very well for you, Warren, you’ve done your book. I’m still ploughing through mine.” What would you tell them?

Warren Knight:                   The best thing, the best advice, I think, that I can give you is you have to be at your most optimum level of preparing and writing the book, otherwise put it down, leave it until you are ready to come back to it when you’re running at full steam ahead. Everybody knows when they have their moments of feeling down and low, and depressed, whatever term you want to use around all of that. But things aren’t going the way that you want them to go. And you also have those moments where you have a meeting, you get off the phone, you’re walking down the street and someone just says to you, “Good morning,” because you’ve got a smile on your face. Whatever that moment is, it’s about when you’re in that moment, pick up your book and do your best work possible, and give yourself the best opportunity to write the book that you deserve and that somebody deserves to read.

Alison Jones:                        So do your writing when you’re in the zone and when you’re full of that positive energy.

Warren Knight:                   Correct.

Alison Jones:                        And that’s kind of counterintuitive, in a way, isn’t … No, I suppose it’s not, but just … When I’m feeling like that I want to be standing, and moving, and talking to people, and performing, and … And the idea of doing that quite solitary activity of sitting and writing, but actually that’s really interesting. Channelling that energy onto the page. Capturing it and distilling it. I love that.

Warren Knight:                   Dictaphones are great things.

Alison Jones:                        Oh, yes, good point.

Warren Knight:                   So when you are in those zones, when I’m speaking I’m in those zones, I will watch back when I’ve been speaking. I will record phone calls, I’ll be transparent around that. I’ll go and have meetings or I’ll have meetings with my team. I’ll go, “Right, I’m going to record this one because I’m in the zone,” and when I’m in the zone I get in a groove. And good things happen when I’m in that groove. And sometimes I don’t even remember what I said five minutes ago with having daddy brain going on. So then I’d have that Dictaphone, just pulls out those little golden nuggets.

Alison Jones:                        That’s so true. I can’t begin to tell you the number of calls we’ve been on where I’ve been working with a client and they’re like, “That was it, that was it!”

Warren Knight:                   Yeah.

Alison Jones:                        And neither of us can remember exactly what we said.

Warren Knight:                   That’s it. Yeah.

Alison Jones:                        Brilliant. I also always ask people to recommend another guest for the show. So somebody with something interesting to say about how business books work in business. Who would suggest would be a great guest for the Extraordinary Business Book Club?

Warren Knight:                   I think, for me, and it’s … This is going to be really weird saying this, but there is a guy called Warren Cass. And I like his energy from stage, I’ve been knowing him and watching him for many years, and he’s recently bought out a book. And I really feel that this person would be great for you to have speaking and having conversations with, because he’s gone through ups. He’s gone through downs. And he’s got a fantastic book, and I really think that it would be fantastic for you and your audience to have a conversation with Warren Cass. So have a chat with Warren.

Alison Jones:                        Okay. We don’t have any limits on the number of people with the same first name, so that’s fine. There’s not a problem there. I don’t know Warren Cass, though, I shall approach him and tell him that you sent me and look forward to speaking to him. Sounds really interesting, thank you. So Warren, if people want to find out more about you, where should they go?

Warren Knight:                   You can go to my website, warrenknight.co.uk, warren-knight.com. I wasn’t able to get the warrenknight.com, an instrument company over in America had had that for many years.

Alison Jones:                        Darn it.

Warren Knight:                   Yeah, damn it. Actually you can follow me on Twitter, so @warrenknight. It took me seven years to get @warrenknight from Twitter. So I’m very, very proud of having the @warrenknight Twitter handle. So yeah, come and follow me on Twitter, connect with me on LinkedIn, Warren Knight inside of LinkedIn. So just go to Google, type in Warren Knight and I’m sure you’ll find me.

Alison Jones:                        Fantastic. Thank you so much. And I tell you what, as a Jones, I feel your pain. I just gave up on getting my name in social media handles. But thank you, it was absolutely fascinating to talk to you, Warren. Thanks so much for your time.

Warren Knight:                   No problem, Alison. It’s been fantastic. So thank you very much and enjoy your day.

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